Health Plans For State Employees Use Medicare's Hammer On Hospital Bills

The new strategy of some health plans for state employees is to pay hospitals a certain percentage above the basic Medicare reimbursement rate. It allows hospitals a small profit, the states say, while reducing costs to states and patients.

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States. They’re just as perplexed as the rest of us over the ever-rising cost of health care premiums.

Now some states –including Montana, North Carolina and Oregonare moving to control costs of state employee health plans. Their strategy: Use Medicare reimbursement rates to recalibrate how they pay hospitals. If the gamble pays off, more private-sector employers could start doing the same thing.

“Government workers will get it first, then everyone else will see the savings and demand it,” says Glenn Melnick, a hospital finance expert and professor at the University of Southern California. “This is the camel’s nose. It will just grow and grow.”

In North Carolina, for instance, state Treasurer Dale Folwell next year plans to start paying most hospitals Medicare rates plus 82 percent — a figure he says would provide for a modest profit margin while saving the state more than $258 million annually.

“State workers can’t afford the family premium [and other costs],” he says. That’s what I’m trying to fix.” The estimated $60 million in savings to health plan members, he says, would mainly come from savings in out-of-pocket costs.

That approach differs from the traditional method of behind-the-scenes negotiating, in which employers or insurers ask for discounts off hospital-set charges that rise every year and generally are many times the actual cost of a service. Payments from private-insurers, even with those discounts, can be double or triple what Medicare would pay.

This state-level activity could be a game changer, fueling a broad movement toward lower payments to hospitals. Montana’s state employee program made the adjustment two years ago; Oregon will start this fall. Delaware’s state employee program is also considering such “Medicare-based contracting” as one of several options to lower spending.

The bold move comes as other factors — notably marketplace competition among hospitals, and high-deductible insurance plans aimed at getting consumers to “shop” for lower prices — have largely failed to slow rising health care premiums.

For hospitals, though, it can be viewed as “an existential threat,” says USC’s Melnick.

Indeed, the treasurer’s plan in North Carolina has drawn heated opposition, with a hospital industry-associated group running television ads that warn of dire financial consequences, especially for rural hospitals. When the plan first came out, the state’s hospital association complained it would reduce hospital revenue statewide by an estimated $460 million.

Hospitals in areas with large concentrations of state workers “would be getting reimbursed less than the cost of care,” says Cody Hand, the association’s senior vice president and deputy general counsel.

“Our biggest concern is this is not something that we were at the table for in discussion,” he says.

Rural hospitals are particularly at risk, Hand says, because many were already teetering on the brink financially and the payment change would be an additional problem.

After months of acrimony, the North Carolina treasurer in mid-March agreed to grant a 20 percent boost in payment to rural hospitals that would give those hospitals an additional $52 million a year. On average, rural hospitals would be paid 218 percent of the Medicare rate.

Nationwide, hospitals have long complained that Medicare underpays them, and some hospital and business groups have warned employers that tying payments from state workers’ plans more closely to Medicare could result in higher charges to private-sector businesses.

“The result will be a cost shift of tens of millions of dollars to other Oregonians,” wrote the Oregon Association of Hospitals and Health Systems as lawmakers there debated a plan (that eventually became law) paying hospitals 200 percent of Medicare rates.

But policy experts are skeptical.

“Even if Medicare pays a bit below cost, 177 percent of Medicare should be at least 50 percent above cost,” says Mark Hall, director of the health law and policy program at Wake Forest University. “Is that a reasonable margin? I guess that’s up for debate, but to most people a 50 percent margin might sound reasonable.”

Another concern some people have raised is that hospitals might refuse to join networks that employ these states’ Medicare-based strategy.

Indeed, Montana officials worked hard to get all hospitals in the state to agree to accept for the state worker program an average of 234 percent of Medicare’s reimbursement rates. A few hospitals held out, right up to the deadline, backing down only after pressure from employee unions.

The risk if hospitals opt to remain out-of-network is that workers could be balance billed for the difference between those Medicare-plus rates and their generally much higher charges — amounts that could be hundreds or even thousands of dollars.

To prevent that, Oregon lawmakers set the law’s in-network reimbursement for hospitals at 200 percent of Medicare’s reimbursement rates. But, those that opt out would receive only 185 percent.

The measure also bars hospitals from billing state workers for the difference between those amounts and the higher rates they might like to charge.

“Oregon thought it through,” says Gerard Anderson, a professor at Johns Hopkins who researches health care costs.

“Hospitals need to go on a diet,” adds Anderson. “The private sector has not put them on a diet, but maybe the state employee plans will.”

Meanwhile, in the private sector …

For decades, health insurance costs for employers and workers have risen faster than inflation, despite various efforts to rein them in.

Currently, a typical family plan offered by employers tops $19,000 a year in premiums, while the price tag for a single employee is close to $7,000.

To be sure, hospital costs make up just one part of what premiums cover, along with doctor costs, drug payments and other services. Spending on hospital care accounts for about one-third of the nation’s $3.5 trillion health care tab.

“Health care is just becoming unaffordable,” says Cheryl DeMars, president and CEO of The Alliance, a group of 240 self-insured employers in the private sector that directly contract with hospitals in Wisconsin, northern Illinois and eastern Iowa.

In January, The Alliance began what it calls “Medicare-plus” contracting. As new hospitals join and existing contracts come up for renewal, the group is negotiating rates, basing them on what Medicare pays, DeMars says.

And it will likely save money: Under its old method of paying, the group was forking out between 200 percent and 350 percent of Medicare for inpatient and outpatient hospital services in its network. Two new contracts have been signed so far, averaging 200 percent of Medicare across inpatient, outpatient and physician payments, according to The Alliance.

“We want to pay a fair price and we’re in the process of determining what that should be,” says Kyle Monroe, vice president of network development for The Alliance. “Is it 200 percent? Is it something less?”

Under traditional payment methods, the negotiated prices insurers for public- and private-sector employers pay for hospital care vary widely — by facility, treatment and insurer. But they’re generally above Medicare rates by a substantial margin.

A group of self-insured employers recently commissioned Rand to study what private insurers pay hospitals in 22 states, compared with Medicare rates.

Initial results found private employers were paying, on average, 229 percent of Medicare rates to hospitals across the states in 2017, according to Chapin White, an adjunct senior policy researcher at Rand who conducted the study.

Economists like Melnick say they would prefer that market competition — consumers voting with their feet, so to speak — would drive business to the highest-quality, lowest-cost providers.

But, so far, hospitals have held the line against this scenario and that’s not likely to change. “They’re going to fight like crazy,” Melnick says.

Kaiser Health News is a nonprofit news service and editorially independent program of the Kaiser Family Foundation. It’s not affiliated with Kaiser Permanente.

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Aspiring Doctors Seek Advanced Training In Addiction Medicine

Dr. Hillary Tamar, who’s in the second year of her family medicine residency in Phoenix, is part of a new generation of doctors who are committed to treating addiction.

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The U.S. surgeon general’s office estimates that more than 20 million people have a substance-use disorder. Meanwhile, the nation’s drug overdose crisis shows no sign of slowing.

Yet, by all accounts, there aren’t nearly enough physicians who specialize in treating addiction — doctors with extensive clinical training who are board certified in addiction medicine.

The opioid epidemic has made this doctor deficit painfully apparent. And it’s spurring medical institutions across the United States to create fellowships for aspiring doctors who want to treat substance-use disorders with the same precision and science as other diseases.

Now numbering more than 60, these fellowship programs offer physicians a year or two of postgraduate training in clinics and hospitals where they learn evidence-based approaches for treating addiction.

Such programs are drawing a new talented generation of idealistic doctors — idealists like Dr. Hillary Tamar.

A drive to connect with patients in need

Tamar, now in the second year of a family medicine residency in Phoenix, wasn’t thinking about addiction medicine when she started medical school in Chicago.

“As a medical student, honestly, you do your ER rotation, people label a patient as ‘pain-seeking’ and it’s bad,” Tamar says. “And that’s all you do about it.”

But in her fourth year of med school, she happened to be assigned to a rotation at a rehab facility in southern Arizona.

“I was able to connect with people in a way that I haven’t been able to connect with them in another specialty,” the 28-year-old recalls.

Working with patients there transformed Tamar’s understanding of addiction, she says, and showed her the potential for doctors to change lives.

“They can go from spending all their time pursuing the acquisition of a substance to being brothers, sisters, daughters [and] fathers making breakfast for their kids again,” she says. “It’s really powerful.”

When Tamar finishes her residency, she’s planning to pursue a fellowship in addiction medicine. She sees addiction medicine, like primary care, as a way to build lasting relationships with patients — and a way to focus on more than a single diagnosis.

“I love when I see addiction patients on my schedule, even if they’re pregnant and on meth,” she says. “More room to do good — it’s exciting.”

Doctors with Tamar’s enthusiasm are sorely needed, says Dr. Anna Lembke, medical director of addiction medicine at Stanford University School of Medicine and a longtime researcher in the field.

“Even 10 years ago,” Lembke says, “I couldn’t find a medical student or resident interested in learning about addiction medicine if I looked under a rock. They were just not out there.”

But Lembke sees a change in the upcoming generation of doctors who are drawn to the field because they care about social justice.

“I now have medical students and residents knocking on my door, emailing me. They all want to learn more about addiction,” Lembke says.

Historically, the path to addiction medicine was through psychiatry.

But that model started to change in 2015, when the American Board of Medical Specialties — considered the gold standard in physician certification in the U.S. — recognized addiction medicine as a bona fide subspecialty and opened up the training to physicians from many other medical fields.

Until then, Lembke says, there had been no way to get addiction fellowships approved through the nationally recognized Accreditation Council for Graduate Medical Education. And that made recruiting young talent — and securing funding for their fellowships — difficult.

Last year, ACGME began accrediting its first batch of addiction medicine fellowship programs.

“We have got an enormous gap between the need and the doctors available to provide that treatment,” Lembke says.

“At least the medical community has begun to wake up to consider not only their role in triggering this opioid epidemic but also the ways they need to step up to solve the problem,” she says.

Build a program, and they will come

When Dr. Luke Peterson finished his residency in family medicine in Phoenix in 2016, there were no addiction medicine fellowships in Arizona.

So he moved to Seattle to complete a yearlong fellowship at Swedish Cherry Hill Family Medicine Residency. There he learned, among other things, how to treat pregnant women who are in recovery from drug use.

“I really needed to do a fellowship if I was going to make an impact and be able to teach others to make the same impact,” says Peterson, who went on to help found an addiction medicine fellowship program in Arizona. His program is based in Phoenix at the University of Arizona’s medical school, and its teaching hospital run by Banner Health, and the Phoenix VA Health Care System.

Arizona’s two addiction medicine fellowship programs received ACGME accreditation last year — a stamp of approval that made the programs desirable choices for up-and-coming physicians, Peterson says.

Not every doctor who plans to treat substance-use disorders needs to do a fellowship, he says. In fact, his goal is to integrate addiction medicine into primary care settings.

But a specialist can serve as a referral center and resource hub for community doctors.

For example, physicians can learn from a specialist such as Peterson how to provide medication-assisted treatment like buprenorphine.

Public health leaders have been pushing to get more physicians trained in evidence-based treatments like buprenorphine, which has been shown to reduce the risk of death among people who have recovered from an opioid overdose.

“As we provide more education and more support to primary care physicians, they will feel more comfortable screening and treating for addiction,” Peterson says.

Peterson’s own journey into addiction medicine began during a rotation with a family doctor in rural Illinois.

“In moments that most doctors find uncomfortable — maybe a patient comes in to request pain medication and you’re seeing the negative side effects — he did not shy away from that situation,” Peterson says. “He addressed it head-on.”

It was a formative experience for Peterson — one he wants other young doctors to have. And he recognizes the urgency.

“In 20 or 30 years from now,” Peterson says, “those medical students are going to look back at my current generation of doctors, and we will be judged by how we responded to this epidemic,” in the same way he and his peers now look back at how doctors handled the HIV epidemic.

One of the first steps in stopping the epidemic, he says, is making sure there are enough doctors on the ground who know how to respond.

Many of today’s medical students, people like Michelle Peterson (no relation to Luke), say they feel the calling too.

She’s in her first year at the University of Arizona College of Medicine in Phoenix and became interested in addiction after working at an outpatient treatment center.

Michelle Peterson, a medical student in Phoenix, says she already knows she wants to be an addiction medicine specialist — and a resource to primary care doctors.

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She says she’s already learning about addiction in her classes, hearing from doctors in the field and seeing other classmates equally engaged.

“It’s definitely not just me,” she says. “There are quite a few people here really interested in addiction.”

It’s a trend she and her mentors hope will continue.

This story is part of NPR’s reporting partnership with KJZZ and Kaiser Health News, an editorially independent news service of the Kaiser Family Foundation that is not affiliated with Kaiser Permanente.

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Why The Promise Of Electronic Health Records Has Gone Unfulfilled

The reality of electronic medical records has yet to live up to the promise.

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A decade ago, the U.S. government claimed that ditching paper medical charts for electronic records would make health care better, safer and cheaper.

Ten years and $36 billion later, the digital revolution has gone awry, an investigation by Kaiser Health News and Fortune magazine has found.

Veteran reporters Fred Schulte of KHN and Erika Fry of Fortune spent months digging into what has happened as a result. (You can read the cover story here.)

Here are five takeaways from the investigation.

Patient harm: Electronic health records have created a host of risks to patient safety. Alarming reports of deaths, serious injuries and near misses — thousands of them — tied to software glitches, user errors or other system flaws have piled up for years in government and private repositories. Yet no central database exists to compile and study these incidents to improve safety.

Signs of fraud: Federal officials say the software can be misused to overcharge, a practice known as “upcoding.” And some doctors and health systems are alleged to have overstated their use of the new technology, a potentially enormous fraud against Medicare and Medicaid likely to take years to unravel. Two software-makers have paid a total of more than $200 million to settle fraud allegations.

Gaps in interoperability: Proponents of electronic health records expected a seamless system so patients could share computerized medical histories in a flash with doctors and hospitals anywhere in the United States. That has yet to materialize, largely because officials allowed hundreds of competing firms to sell medical-records software unable to exchange information among one another.

Doctor burnout: Many doctors say they spend half their day or more clicking pull-down menus and typing rather than interacting with patients. An emergency room doctor can be saddled with making up to 4,000 mouse clicks per shift. This has fueled concerns about doctor burnout, which a January report by the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, the Massachusetts Medical Society and two other organizations called a “public health crisis.”

Web of secrets: Entrenched policies continue to keep software failures out of public view. Vendors of electronic health records have imposed contractual “gag clauses” that discourage buyers from speaking out about safety issues and disastrous software installations — and some hospitals fight to withhold records from injured patients or their families.

Kaiser Health News is an editorially independent news service supported by the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation. KHN is not affiliated with Kaiser Permanente.

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Former Physician At Rikers Island Exposes Health Risks Of Incarceration

Dr. Homer Venters, the former head of New York City’s correctional health services, says that inmates held in solitary confinement cells, such as the Rikers Island cell shown above, have a higher risk of committing self-harm.

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As head of New York City’s correctional health services, Dr. Homer Venters spent nine years overseeing the care of thousands of inmates in the jails on Rikers Island. Though he left Rikers in 2017, what he witnessed on the job has stayed with him.

“What’s important to consider about jail settings is that they are incredibly dehumanizing, and they dehumanize the individuals who pass through them,” Venters says. “There is not really a true respect for the rights of the detained.”

Venters is now a senior health and justice fellow at Community Oriented Correctional Health Services. In his new book, Life and Death in Rikers Island, he describes a number of traumatic outcomes related to what he says was subpar medical care at the jail complex, including the death of Carlos Mercado, a man with diabetes who was denied insulin during the intake process.

“This type of death really shows, in a very stark way, how jails confer health risk to people,” Venters says. “For a person to know that they are insulin-dependent — to report that and then for any state institution to fail to act on that, really puts the onus and responsibility for this man’s death directly on the jail system.”

During his tenure at Rikers, Venters pushed to improve the electronic medical records system, allowing health data from the jail to be shared with outside agencies, including the Department of Justice. He sees it as a first step in a larger effort to address abusive conditions and improve inmate care.

Working at Rikers, Venters says, “left me with a zeal to continue this work all over the country. … The problems of Rikers are in many cases the problems of jails and prisons everywhere in the United States.”


Interview highlights

On his first time at Rikers Island

I happened to go there for the first time on a day where there was a very strong snowstorm. As someone was showing me around some of the facilities, the snow was coming down so quickly it really did seem like a scene from a sci-fi movie. I couldn’t believe that the structures looming up one after the other were real. [And] the yelling coming out — the two biggest and most well-constructed facilities at the time on the island were these big buildings that look like hotels. But they were built for solitary confinement, so people [were] screaming and yelling out of those big structures, through this very thick snowfall. It left an indelible impression on me.

On not being able to find patients who need medical care because of delays in paperwork and an antiquated paper logging system

Patients would be moved from one housing area to another, and sometimes their move would be updated a couple of days later. Somebody would have to type it into a computer system. But it would mostly be updated on a paper-based log. Since I left they’ve started implementing some wristbands that could be scanned, but it’s the same problem — an officer has to do something, [and] you have to affirmatively track it.

So for us with a big health service — thousands of patients on medications every single day — we had pharmacy technicians, psychologists [and] nurses who were working hard just to find the patients who had missed medicines — who could be facing a life-threatening event if they miss that medicine. It was so routine that we couldn’t find our patients that there was no thought that we could find everybody who didn’t get their medicine today. But we would make short lists of the people who missed medicines that were what we would call “life-sustaining medicines,” or who could face a very dire health outcome, and that expenditure of energy for that purpose would become revealed when patients had very bad outcomes.

On tracking data about inmates sustaining injuries from correctional officers

One data point that’s really incredible to consider is that there was a time when, if an adolescent was in a violent conflict with someone in Rikers Island, if the conflict was with a correctional officer they were more likely to sustain a blow to the head than if the conflict was with another inmate. It’s stunning, because obviously correctional officers have enormous amounts of training about avoiding blows to the head. … And also you would think that most inmate fights start with a shot to the head. But that data point alone … we could only do because we had developed this injury surveillance system. But it was one of many that we pushed to the D.O.J.

On what data revealed about solitary confinement

The other big data set that we found very, very helpful is we did a large-scale analysis — I think the first-ever large scale analysis — of exposure to solitary confinement. We looked at 225,000 jail admissions and we found that the people … exposed to solitary confinement had about seven times higher risk of being a self-harm cohort. That is to say, to physically harm themselves. That data set … helped us really push the Department of Corrections to move from wanting more solitary confinement for mentally ill people, to actually eliminate the practice of solitary confinement for persons with serious mental illness.

On the conditions of solitary confinement units, where raw sewage often overflows because of clogged toilets

It is horrific but also dehumanizing. It really reflects quite well the end result of the practice of solitary confinement. That is to say, you have officers trying to act as if they are conducting normal business. You have patients with mental health problems who are decompensating [– functionally deteriorating under the stress –] or simply doing extreme things to try and get out of there. You have health staff coming on and off those units as quickly as they can, because while they want to protect their patients, they also are seeing this day after day after day. …

I’ve been inside these cells to talk to patients multiple times when they’ve smeared feces all over the inside of the cell. Or they’re working to light a fire inside their cell. It’s just very, very extreme behaviors and any one of these observations should be enough to reaffirm that this is a horrible practice– that we should have never built this unit and we need to back away from its use everywhere.

On if he believes Rikers Island should close

The closing of Rikers is absolutely necessary. It’s not sufficient to transform the criminal justice system in New York City to become more humane, but it’s necessary. The jails that are in operation are crumbling. If you’re a correctional officer, almost anywhere you work, any housing area, any hallway, any intake pen is so dilapidated and falling apart that inmates easily can arm themselves — and do for their own protection — with bits of hardened material that are broken off from walls; from pipes; from ceilings.

I think the other important element to this is that we have much more work to do to lower the jail population. We’ve made great strides in New York City, more than most big cities have. There were probably [22,000 to] 23,000 people in the jails when [Rudolph] Giuliani was mayor. It’s now under 8,000, so really incredible progress. But there is much more work that can be done to create alternatives that involve treatment for people with serious mental illness, and also to really develop supportive housing, which is an important element to why people cycle in and out of jail. [There’s] a lack of stable housing. [Housing] can also involve treatment for addiction and for mental health problems.

Roberta Shorrock and Seth Kelley produced and edited the audio of this interview. Bridget Bentz and Molly Seavy-Nesper adapted it for Shots.

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Ending HIV In Mississippi Means Cutting Through Racism, Poverty And Homophobia

Shawn Esco brings his dog Nibbler to a park in Jackson, Miss. He’s was diagnosed with HIV 11 years ago and has stayed healthy, but the same can’t be said of many of the other HIV-positive people in his life.

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Ending HIV transmission in America within the next decade — a stated goal of the Trump Administration — isn’t a question of coming up with new medication. The medicines to prevent and treat HIV infections already exist.

But the road to eliminating HIV and AIDS runs through the deep South, where racism, poverty, and homophobia can be formidable obstacles to testing and treatment, particularly for black gay men. According to a Centers for Disease Control and Prevention report in 2017, more than half the new HIV diagnoses in the U.S. were in Southern states, where gay and bisexual black men make up a disproportionate share of people with HIV.

Shawn Esco lives and works in Jackson, Miss. — a city with one of the highest HIV rates in the country.

Esco remembers the moment he realized he was HIV positive. Eleven years ago, he went to a clinic to get a routine HIV test. Workers there invited him into a private room for the results, and he says he knew — before they even said a word.

“When they opened the door,” Esco says, “there was all this new literature that said ‘HIV this,’ ‘AIDS that.’ And you could tell it was there for me.”

The Supreme Court of Mississippi in Jackson, Miss. The city has one of the highest HIV rates in the United States.

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Esco is now 37, and lives in an apartment with an affectionate pit bull named Nibbler. He’s stayed healthy in the time since his diagnosis, but the same can’t be said of many of the other HIV-positive people in his life.

In 2011, after good HIV treatments were available, Esco’s best friend from high school died of AIDS-related causes.

“I was extremely pissed off at him,” Esco says,” Because it could have been avoided. All he had to do was want to live.”

Esco says the death of that friend was the hardest to endure, but not his only loss. One of Esco’s exes also died of an AIDS-related condition. And another friend took his own life after he got his diagnosis — out of fear his family would find out.

A few years ago CDC researchers estimated that, at current infection rates, about half of all black men who have sex with men (and 25 percent of Latino gay and bisexual men) in the U.S. will be diagnosed with HIV in their lifetime.

In 2011, Esco’s best friend from high school died of AIDS-related causes. One of Esco’s exes also died of an AIDS-related condition. And another friend took his own life after he got his diagnosis — out of fear his family would find out.

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When Esco considers the possibility of ending the epidemic in the next 10 years, he takes into account issues like homophobia, racism, lack of education and stigma, and is blunt: “Given the way things are now, that’s not going to happen.”

In the South, many gay and bisexual black men don’t know the extent of the HIV problem, he says. And, if they do, they may not have access to the tools to prevent and treat the disease.

These are problems that Dr. Leandro Mena tries to solve. He’s an HIV researcher and clinician, and a professor of population health science at the University of Mississippi. Mena also works with My Brother’s Keeper, a community-based nonprofit working to eliminate health disparities in underserved populations.

“Science has given us the tools to end the HIV epidemic,” Mena points out. “The challenge that we have is that we need to make sure those tools can reach those who actually need it most.”

HIV seems easy to keep in check, he says: There’s a daily pill that can keep someone who is infected with the virus healthy.

But things can get complicated fast if you’re poor.

The memorial grove behind Grace House, in Jackson, Miss., where the ashes of more than 45 former residents now rest. Grace House was once a hospice for people dying of AIDS. Today the organization offers hundreds of people in Jackson financial assistance for housing.

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“What are the chances that you may remember to take a medicine that you have to take every day,” he says, “if, this morning, you wake up and you don’t have electricity or you don’t have any money to feed your family?”

Getting access to good health care of any kind — let alone lifesaving medicine — can be especially difficult for people living in rural parts of the south, Mena says. And Mississippi is the poorest state in the country.

Some people in Mississippi who are living with HIV wind up on the doorstep of Grace House, which was once a hospice for people dying of AIDS. Today the organization offers hundreds of people in Jackson financial assistance for housing, and also provides rooms for a few dozen people facing particularly severe challenges, such as addiction or mental health issues.

The Grace House compound in Jackson consists of a cluster of several homes, with a shared backyard and a garden.

It also includes a memorial grove, where statues of angels stand around the base of a tree, memorializing people whose deaths were AIDS-related.

Catherine Sullivan is executive director of Grace House, a Jackson nonprofit that offers transitional and semi-permanent housing and support services for homeless men and women living with HIV/AIDS and women recovering from substance abuse.

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Catherine Sullivan, executive director of the organization, says the ashes of more than 45 people have been spread in the grove — “some of whom were with us at Grace House when they died; some of whose families wouldn’t pick them up from the morgue. And so we buried them.”

Just four months ago, a Grace House resident named Donna died of an AIDS-related illness. She had spent her life struggling to live openly as a transgender woman.

Sullivan keeps photos from Donna’s funeral on her phone: Donna lying peacefully in a coffin, impeccably made up, in a long white gown.

“It makes me really sad,” Sullivan says, looking at the photos. “Because, in death, who she was is honored in a way that got lost in life most of the time.”

Jeremy Williams got HIV before there was a daily pill to prevent infection in people who are at high risk. That pill is known as PrEP — pre-exposure prophylaxis. A lot of gay and bisexual men in the South are not on PrEP, doctors say, either because they don’t know it exists, or because they can’t afford it.

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Those sorts of stories are familiar to many at Grace House, where residents now are able to live openly and get access to care.

Jeremy Williams, 32, got HIV from his college boyfriend. Williams grew up in rural Mississippi, where HIV treatment was hard to come by.

“You have to drive like an hour or two or three for quality care,” he says.

Williams got HIV before there was a daily pill to prevent infection in people who are at high risk. That pill is known as PrEP — pre-exposure prophylaxis. A lot of gay and bisexual men in the South are not on PrEP — either because they don’t know it exists, or because they can’t afford it. It can cost up to $1,600 a month without insurance. Mississippi has fought against expanding Medicaid, which could have given more people access to HIV prevention and treatment.

Williams says the cost of treatment was kept in check when he was first diagnosed, because he was on his father’s insurance. “But once I got over a certain age, I couldn’t be on his insurance no more, and I couldn’t afford the treatment,” he says.

Today, a daily HIV treatment pill, paid for by the state-administered AIDS Drug Assistance Program, has made his viral load undetectable. So it’s extremely unlikely that he could infect anyone else.

Dating back to the early 1900s, Farish Street was once an epicenter of black life and commerce in Jackson, Miss.

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Williams says there’s another issue that makes it hard for him and many other young gay or bisexual black men to protect their sexual health: He was raised in a church that tried to convert gay people to heterosexuality. Shame was part of his daily life.

“The words that people say, they linger,” Williams says. “They linger on for years. And you just — it was like a repeated broken record over and over again. You know: ‘You’re not good enough.’ ‘You’re never going to have anybody.’ ‘No one is going to love you because you have this disease.’ I was just carrying it, you know, like it’s a garment — like all of my shame and stuff.”

There’s also a lack of specialized HIV/AIDS knowledge among too many doctors in the South, says Sandra Melvin, the chief operating officer at Jackson’s Open Arms Health Clinic, where HIV-positive patients can receive care. She says many physicians in the region don’t know about PrEP. And that goes to a broader issue.

“In some cases, I think the training has something to do with it,” Melvin says. “Medical schools don’t focus on certain things — cultural competence, how to deliver health care in rural areas. Those are all things that I think in medical school need to be a focus for young and upcoming physicians or health care providers.”

Tiffany West, a medical assistant with the Open Arms Mobile Health Clinic, prepares to administer HIV tests to students at Tougaloo College, north of Jackson.

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Attitudes among Mississippi’s elected leaders are also part of the problem, Melvin believes.

“I think that part of what has to happen in this state is that we have to start electing people who reflect the demographics of our society,” she says.

People working to fight the HIV epidemic in Mississippi point to one recent example of a law that they believe promoted homophobic values that could increase the stigma around HIV. In 2016, the state passed a bill into law that allows doctors to refuse to serve certain patients, based on the doctor’s religious beliefs — even if those beliefs seem to be anti-gay.

While there’s no public evidence yet of a doctor refusing to treat a gay patient, critics of the law fear it could deter many people from seeking health care.

One of the Republican sponsors of the bill, Rep. Dan Eubanks, says those fears are misguided.

Hip-hop plays inside the Open Arms Mobile Health Clinic, as a way to help the students at Tougaloo College feel more comfortable while they await testing for HIV or other STDs.

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“I think it’s reaching to try and say that this bill is going to make it worse for people with AIDS, because that was never the intention of the bill,” Eubanks says. “The intention of the bill was to protect people’s First Amendment right to adhere to the tenets of the faith — which is guaranteed in our Constitution.”

Eubanks believes that ending HIV requires education, including education about abstinence and about personal responsibility.

“If you know that participating in unprotected sex is dangerous, but yet you do nothing to try and alleviate that, you greatly increased your odds and chances of contracting a disease,” Eubanks says. “So there’s a certain amount of personal responsibility — and that has nothing to do with sexual preference.”

The Open Arms Health Care clinic operates a mobile clinic that visits college campuses so students can get tested for HIV and other sexually transmitted diseases.

DeAndré Steward, 20, showed up for the clinic when it came to Tougaloo University, outside of Jackson. Steward is black and gay, and he’s aware of the soaring infection rates in his demographic.

“It is honestly very scary,” Steward says. “We’re all sexual creatures, so we’re going to have sex.”

Gerald Gibson (left), manager of the Open Arms Mobile Health Clinic talks with Javier Heniquez, a student at Tougaloo College, as he leaves the clinic.

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Condoms are cheaper than PrEP, and also effective at preventing HIV transmission. Steward knows this but he also knows another reality.

“You need to always use protection,” he says. “But people don’t, which is why they’re scared half to death when they’re going to get tested.”

Steward faces many of the same challenges that Esco and Williams do, but he’s from a younger generation. When asked whether he thinks the HIV epidemic can become a thing of the past, he’s optimistic.

“Absolutely,” he says. “The older generations, they still weren’t as educated on AIDS as they should have been. You know, their minds aren’t that open — our generation’s minds are.”

Steward tested negative for HIV at the clinic, and he plans to stay that way. But one of the best ways to do so would be to get on PrEP. He’d like to do so, he says, but it costs too much.

Editor’s note: In the audio version of this story, which first aired Feb. 14, Jeremy Williams’ last name was not used at his request. He has since decided he is comfortable having NPR using his full name and photograph for this digital version.

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Trump Administration Cuts The Size Of Fines For Health Violations In Nursing Homes

Federal records show that the average fine for a health or safety infraction by a nursing home dropped to $28,405 under the Trump administration, down from $41,260 in 2016, President Obama’s final year in office.

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The Trump administration’s decision to alter the way it punishes nursing homes has resulted in lower fines against many facilities found to have endangered or injured residents.

Federal records show that the average fine dropped to $28,405 under the current administration, down from $41,260 in 2016, President Obama’s final year in office.

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The decrease in fines is one of the starkest examples of how, in response to industry prodding, the Trump administration is rolling back Obama’s aggressive regulation of health care services.

Encouraged by the nursing home industry, the Trump administration switched from fining nursing homes for each day they were out of compliance — as the Obama administration typically did — to issuing a single fine for two-thirds of infractions, the records show.

That reduces the impact of the penalty, critics say, giving nursing homes less incentive to fix faulty and dangerous practices before someone gets hurt.

“It’s not changing behavior [at nursing homes] in the way that we want,” says Dr. Ashish Jha, a professor at the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health. “For a small nursing home, it could be real money, but for bigger ones, it’s more likely a rounding error.”

Since President Trump took office, the administration has heeded complaints from the nursing home industry about zealous oversight. It granted facilities an 18-month moratorium from being penalized for violating eight new health and safety rules. It also revoked an Obama-era rule barring the facilities from pre-emptively requiring residents to submit to arbitration to settle disputes rather than go to court.

The reduction in total fines occurred even as the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services issued financial penalties 28 percent more frequently than it did under Obama. That increase in the frequency of citations with financial consequences arose because of a policy begun near the end of Obama’s term that required regulators to punish a facility every time a resident was harmed, instead of leaving it to their discretion.

While that policy increased the number of smaller fines, larger fines became less common. The total amount collected under Trump fell by 10 percent compared with the total in Obama’s final year — from $127 million under Obama to $114 million under Trump. (We compared penalties during 2016, Obama’s last year in office, with penalties under Trump from April 2017 through March 2018, the most recent month for which federal officials say data is reliably complete.)

CMS says it has revised multiple rules governing fines under both administrations to make its punishments fairer, more consistent and better tailored to prod nursing homes to improve care. “We are continuing to analyze the impact of these combined events to determine if other actions are necessary,” CMS said in a written statement.

The move toward smaller financial penalties is broadly consistent with the Trump administration’s other industry-friendly policies in the health care sector. For instance, the administration has expanded the role of short-term health insurance policies that don’t cover all types of services, has given states more leeway to change their Medicaid programs and has urged Congress to allow physicians to open their own hospitals.

Beth Martino, a spokeswoman for the American Health Care Association, a trade group for nursing homes, says the federal government has “returned to a method of applying fines in a way that incentivizes solving problems” rather than penalizing “facilities that are trying to do the right thing.”

Penalty guidelines were toughened in 2014 when the Obama administration instructed officials to favor daily fines. By 2016, that approach was applied in two-thirds of cases. Those fines averaged $61,000.

When Trump took over, the nursing home industry complained that fines had spun “out of control” and had become disproportionate to the deficiencies. “We have seen a dramatic increase in [fines] being retroactively issued and used as a punishment,” Mark Parkinson, president and CEO of the American Health Care Association, wrote in March 2017.

CMS agreed that daily fines sometimes resulted in punishments that were determined by the random timing of an inspection rather than the severity of the infraction. If inspectors visited a home in April, for instance, and discovered that an improper practice had started in February, the accumulated daily fines would be twice as much as if the inspectors had come in March.

But switching to a preference for per-instance fines means much smaller penalties, since fines are capped at $21,393 whether they are levied per instance or per day. Nursing homes that pay without contesting the fine receive a 35 percent discount, meaning they currently pay at most $13,905.

Those maximums apply even to facilities found to have committed the most serious level of violations, which are known as immediate jeopardy because the nursing home’s practices place residents at imminent risk of harm. For instance, a Mississippi nursing home was fined $13,627 after it ran out of medications because it had been relying on a pharmacy 373 miles away, in Atlanta. CMS also reduced $54,600 in daily fines to a single fine of $20,965 for a New Mexico home where workers hadn’t been properly disinfecting equipment to prevent infectious diseases from spreading.

On average, per-instance fines under Trump were below $9,000, records show.

“These are multimillion-dollar businesses — $9,000 is nothing,” says Toby Edelman, a senior policy attorney at the Center for Medicare Advocacy, a nonprofit in Washington.

Big daily fines, averaging $68,080, are still issued when a home hasn’t corrected a violation after being cited. But even in those cases, CMS officials are allowed to make exceptions and issue a single fine if the home has no history of substantial violations.

The agency cautioned that comparing average fines is misleading because the overall number of inspections resulting in fines increased under Trump, from 3.5 percent in 2016 to 4.7 percent. The circumstances now warranting fines that weren’t issued before tend to draw penalties on the lower side.

However, Kaiser Health News found that financial penalties for immediate jeopardies were issued in fewer cases under Trump. And when they were issued, the fines averaged 18 percent less than they did in 2016.

The frequency of immediate-jeopardy fines may decrease even more. CMS told inspectors in June that they were no longer required to fine facilities unless immediate-jeopardy violations resulted in “serious injury, harm, impairment or death.” Regulators still must take some action, but that could be ordering the nursing home to arrange training from an outside group or mandating specific changes to the way the home operates.

Barbara Gay, vice president of public policy communications at LeadingAge — an association of nonprofit organizations that provide elder services, including nursing homes — says that nursing homes “don’t feel they’ve been given a reprieve” under Trump.

But consumer advocates say penalties have reverted to levels too low to be effective.

“Fines need to be large enough to change facility behavior,” says Robyn Grant, director of public policy and advocacy at the National Consumer Voice for Quality Long-Term Care, a nonprofit based in Washington, D.C. “When that’s not the case and the fine is inconsequential, care generally doesn’t improve.”

Kaiser Health News is an editorially independent news service supported by the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation. KHN is not affiliated with Kaiser Permanente. You can follow Jordan Rau on Twitter: @jordanrau.

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Why An ER Visit Can Cost So Much — Even For Those With Health Insurance

Vox reporter Sarah Kliff spent over a year reading thousands of ER bills and investigating the reasons behind the costs, including hidden fees, overpriced supplies and out-of-network doctors.



TERRY GROSS, HOST:

This is FRESH AIR. I’m Terry Gross. You wouldn’t believe what some emergency rooms charge, or maybe you would because you’ve gotten bills. For example, one hospital charged $76 for Bacitracin antibacterial ointment. One woman who fell and cut her ear and was given an ice pack but no other treatment was billed $5,751. My guest, Sarah Kliff, is a health policy journalist at vox.com who spent over a year investigating why ER bills are so high even with health insurance and why the charges vary so widely from one hospital to the next.

Through crowdsourcing, she collected over a thousand ER bills from around the country. She interviewed many of the patients and the people behind the billing. She’s reported her findings in a series of articles on Vox. She’s also spent years reporting on the battle over health insurance policy. We’ll get some updates on the state of Obamacare a little later in the interview.

Sarah Kliff, welcome back to FRESH AIR. Why did you want to do an investigation into emergency room billing?

SARAH KLIFF: You know, I wanted to do this because the emergency room is such a common place where Americans interact with the health care system. There are about 140 million ER visits each year. It’s a place where you can’t really shop for health care. You can’t make a lot of decisions about where you want to go. So I think that is big-picture what got me interested.

Small picture was actually a bill that someone sent me almost three years ago now, where they took their daughter to the emergency room. A Band-Aid was put on the daughter’s finger, and they left. And they got a $629 bill. And they said – you know, they – the parents sent this to me, saying, how could a Band-Aid cost $629? And I said, I don’t know, but I’m going to find out. And that kind of opened up the door to this, you know, multi-year project I’ve been working on right now. It started with trying to figure out why a Band-Aid would cost $629.

GROSS: OK. So let’s get to that $629 for treatment that was basically a Band-Aid placed on a finger. You investigated that bill.

KLIFF: Yes.

GROSS: Why’d it cost so much?

KLIFF: So what cost so much was really the facility fee. So this is a charge I hadn’t heard about before as a health care reporter. This is a charge that hospitals make for just keeping their doors open, keeping the lights on, the cost of running an emergency room 24/7. So if you look at that particular patient’s bill, the Band-Aid – you know, I hesitate to say only – but the Band-Aid only cost $7, which, as anyone who’s bought Band-Aids knows, is quite expensive for a single Band-Aid.

But the other $622 of that bill were the hospital’s facility fees for just walking in the door and seeking service. And these fees are not made public. They vary wildly from one hospital to another. And usually patients only find out what the facility fee of their hospital is when they receive the bill afterwards, like that patient, you know, that sent me this particular bill.

GROSS: And does the facility fee vary from facility to facility?

KLIFF: It does significantly. You know, I’ve seen some that are in the low hundreds. I’ve seen some that are in the high thousands. And it’s impossible to know what facility fee you’re going to be charged until you actually get the billing documents from your hospital. And if you try and call up a hospital and ask what the facility fee is, usually you won’t get very far.

So it’s this fee that, from all the ER bills I’ve read, is usually the biggest line item on the bill. But it’s also one that is very, very difficult to get good information about until you’ve already been charged.

GROSS: So you’re paying the facility fee to basically share in the cost of running the emergency room.

KLIFF: Yes, that’s how hospital executives would describe the fee.

GROSS: But you don’t know that when you’re going to the emergency room.

KLIFF: You don’t, no. And you don’t know how much it’ll be. You don’t know how it’s being split up between different patients. You don’t know any of that.

GROSS: So is this also why one bill had $60 for the treatment of ibuprofen and another $238 for the treatment of eyedrops?

KLIFF: Yeah. And, you know, this is something I see all the time reading emergency bills – I’ve read about 1,500 of them at this point – is that things you could buy in a drugstore often cost significantly more in the emergency room. And the people I talked to who run hospitals will say this is because they have to be open all the time. They have to have so many supplies ready.

But I think one of the things that I find pretty frustrating is, you know, patients aren’t usually told, we can give you an ibuprofen here, or you can pick some up at the drugstore if you leave, and the cost will be a fraction of what we would charge you here. That information often isn’t conveyed to patients who are well enough, you know, to go to a drugstore on their own. But it’s just huge variation for these simple items.

One place I see this a lot is pregnancy tests. If you’re a woman who’s of childbearing age, you go to the emergency room, they will often want to check if you’re pregnant. I’ve seen pregnancy tests that cost a few dollars in emergency room. The most expensive one I saw was over $400. I believe that was at a hospital in Texas. It’s just widespread variation for, you know, some pretty simple pieces of medical equipment.

GROSS: I want to get back to the $60 ibuprofen. Is that – does that include the facility fee? Or is that just for the ibuprofen, and the facility fee is separate?

KLIFF: That’s just for the ibuprofen. The facility fee is totally separate.

GROSS: So how do they justify that?

KLIFF: They say they have to stock, like, a wide array of medicine, so they have to have everything on hand from ibuprofen, from, you know, expensive rabies treatments – I’ve talked to a lot of people who’ve been to the emergency room for exposure to bats and raccoons – and that they need to have all these things in stock. And, you know, one of the things you pay for at the emergency room is the ability to get any medication at any hour of the day right when you need it. I don’t necessarily buy that explanation, to be clear. That’s what I’ve heard from hospital executives.

I think it’s pretty telling that ibuprofen has a very, very different price depending on which emergency room you go to. The fact that there’s so much widespread price variation suggests to me that it’s not just the cost of doing business driving it, that there’s also business decisions being made behind ibuprofen that are driving the prices different hospitals are setting.

GROSS: Now, of course, trips to the emergency room aren’t always as simple as getting a Band-Aid or ibuprofen or some eyedrops. I want you to describe the case of a young man who was hit by a pole on a city bus in San Francisco.

KLIFF: Yeah. So this patient, his name is Justin. He was a community college student in northern California, was walking down a sidewalk in downtown San Francisco one day. And there was a pole hanging off the back of the bus that wasn’t where it’s supposed to be. It essentially flew off the back of the bus, hit him in the face and knocked him unconscious.

And the next thing he knows, he’s waking up at Zuckerberg San Francisco General, which is the only Level I trauma center in the city. He ends up needing a CT scan to check out some brain injuries. He needs some stitches. And then he’s discharged. He ends up with a bill for $27,000.

But, you know, as I began figuring out through my reporting, San Francisco General does not contract with private insurance, and they end up pursuing him for the vast majority of that bill. He has $27,000 outstanding. And somewhat ironically, San Francisco General, it is the city hospital. It is run by the city of San Francisco. So this student is hit by a city bus, taken by an ambulance to the city hospital and ends up with a $27,000 bill as a result.

GROSS: So did he have insurance?

KLIFF: He did. He had insurance through his dad.

GROSS: So why doesn’t Zuckerberg San Francisco General Hospital contract with private insurers?

KLIFF: So what they have told me when I’ve talked to some spokespeople there is that they are a safety net hospital, and that is, you know, definitely true. They generally serve a lower-income, often indigent population in San Francisco that would have trouble getting admitted and seeking care at other hospitals in the city. So they have told me that their focus is on serving those patients and that therefore, you know, they’re not going to contract with private insurance companies.

The thing I found a little bit confusing about that, though, is there are lots of public hospitals, say, that, you know, also serve low-income populations. And some of them for their inpatient units, you know, for their scheduled surgeries, they’re not going to contract with private insurance because they want to make sure beds are available for the publicly insured folks and people on Medicaid and Medicare.

But when it comes to the emergency room, you know, every other public hospital I was in touch with would contract with private insurers there because people don’t decide if they’re going to end up in the emergency room. So, you know, that’s the justification they offered, that it is a hospital meant to serve those with public insurance. But it is not something you see public hospitals typically doing.

GROSS: Isn’t – I think legislation was proposed in California to change that. Did that pass?

KLIFF: It’s still pending in the California State Assembly. And the hospital has also promised to reform its billing practices, although we haven’t seen what exactly their new plan is yet.

GROSS: So the position that Justin was in is that, like, he’s unconscious. He’s not asking to be taken anyplace. (Laughter) But he’s unconscious. He’s taken to the emergency room and ends up getting this $27,000 bill. I mean, that just seems so unfair, especially since he has insurance.

KLIFF: Yeah.

GROSS: Like, it’s supposed to cover him for things like that (laughter).

KLIFF: Yeah. You know, there’s one other patient who kind of makes this point really well who was also seen at San Francisco General. Her name is Nelly. And she fell off a climbing wall and, somewhat amazingly, you know, turns out she had a concussion. But one of the first things she does is she calls her insurance’s nursing hotline to ask, should I go to the ER?

And they say yes. And she says, can I go to Zuckerberg San Francisco General? It’s the closest. They say, no, don’t go there. It’s not in network. Go to another hospital. She gets to the other hospital, but the other hospital won’t see her because she’s a trauma patient. She fell from a really high height. And San Francisco General is the only trauma center in San Francisco. So she tries to go to an in-network hospital. She’s then ambulance-transferred to Zuckerberg San Francisco General, and she ends up with another bill over $20,000 that the hospital was pursuing from her until I started asking questions from it, and the hospital ultimately dropped the bill.

But I think it’s just such a frustrating situation for someone like Justin, for someone like Nellie (ph). They’re either shopping for this good unconscious, they’re really trying to do the right thing, and the health care system is just so stacked against the patient. It’s so stacked for the hospital to be able to bill the prices that they want to bill.

GROSS: So apparently, the moral of the story is if you want to challenge your emergency room bill, you should get Sarah Kliff to write about you. (Laughter).

KLIFF: It’s – (laughter). That’s what some people have said. But there’s only one of me, and there’s about 2,000 bills in our database. And, you know, we have had over $100,000 in bills reversed as a result of our series. But I don’t think it’s a great way to run a health care system where we just, you know, the people who get their bills reversed are those who are lucky enough to have a reporter write a story about them.

GROSS: Yes. Agreed. Let me reintroduce you. If you’re just joining us, my guest is Sarah Kliff. She’s a senior policy correspondent at Vox, where she focuses on health policy. She also hosts the Vox podcast, “The Impact,” about how policy actually affects people.

So we’re going to take a short break, and then we’ll talk more about emergency billing. And then later, we’ll talk about what’s left of Obamacare, and what the president and Congress and candidates are saying about health care, after this break. This is FRESH AIR.

(SOUNDBITE OF ALEXANDRE DESPLAT’S “SPY MEETING”)

GROSS: This is FRESH AIR. And if you’re just joining us, my guest is Sarah Kliff. We’re talking about emergency room billing and why it’s so unpredictable and often so incredibly high. She’s a senior policy correspondent at Vox, where she focuses on health policy. She also hosts the Vox podcast, “The Impact,” about how policy affects people.

So we were talking about the hidden facility fee, which most people don’t know exists, and is responsible for a large chunk of a lot of emergency room bills. There’s also, like, a trauma unit fee. It’s a similar hidden fee in hospitals that have trauma centers in their emergency rooms. So explain the trauma fee and how that kicks in.

KLIFF: Yeah. This is something I also had never heard of till I started reading a lot of emergency room bills, and this is the fee that trauma centers charge for essentially assembling a trauma team to meet you when you’re coming in and those folks out in the field, maybe the EMTs, for example, have determined that you meet certain trauma criteria.

So I’ve talked to people who have been charged trauma fees who were in serious car accidents. One case was a baby who fell from more than 3 feet, and that’s considered to trigger a trauma activation. So this is essentially the price for having a robust trauma team – a surgeon, an anesthesiologist, nurses – all at the ready to receive you when you get to the hospital.

And again, these fees can be pretty hefty. San Francisco General, which, I’ve done the most reporting on their billing, you know, they can charge up to $18,000 for their trauma activation services. I wrote about one family who was visiting San Francisco from Korea when their young son rolled out of the hotel bed. They were nervous. They didn’t know the American health care system well. So they called 911, which sent an ambulance, brought him over to the hospital. Turns out, he was fine. They gave him a bottle of formula. He took a nap and went home.

And then a few months later, they get an $18,000 charge for the trauma team that assembled for when that baby came to the hospital. And these are another, you know, pretty significant fee that, again, you don’t really know about. You have no idea that the trauma team is assembling to meet you when you’re coming into the hospital. You just find out after the fact. And you also have no say in the decision to assemble trauma. That’s really left up to the hospital, not the patient.

GROSS: So I’m going to have you compare two possibilities. You go to an emergency room, and the bill is very high. There’s two people who have the same problem who go to the emergency room. One of them has a copay. One of them has a high deductible that they haven’t paid off yet. How are they treated differently, in terms of what they’re billed for the emergency room visit?

KLIFF: Well, the person with the deductible will likely be billed significantly more. You know, if they’re just, let’s say, at the start of the year, they are going to essentially have to bear the costs of that emergency room visit up until the point they hit their deductible and the insurance kicks in, whereas the person who has a co-payment, they’re just going to have to pay that flat fee and, you know, probably not worry about paying more, but there’s often surprise bills lurking in the corner that could affect both of those patients as well.

GROSS: Like what?

KLIFF: So one of the most common things we see is out-of-network doctors working at in-network emergency rooms. So you know, you have an emergency, you look up a hospital, you see their ER is in network, so you go there. It turns out that emergency room is staffed by doctors who aren’t in your insurance. There’s pretty compelling academic research that suggests 1 in 5 emergency room visits involves a surprise bill like that one.

GROSS: That seems so unfair. How are you to know – if you’re choosing a hospital that’s in network, how are you to know whether the doctor treating you is in network or not?

KLIFF: You know, you really – there isn’t a great way to tell, to be honest. This is – you know, when I had to go to the emergency room over the summer, you know, this is something I worried about. You know, I was seeing a doctor who worked for the hospital, but they were sending off my ultrasound to be read by a radiologist who I was never going to meet. I couldn’t ask them if they were in-network. I just kind of had to cross my fingers and hope for the best, and luckily, I didn’t get a surprise bill.

But I’ve talked to multiple patients who, you know, tried to do their research, who thought they were in network, only to get a bill, often for thousands of dollars, after leaving the emergency room, from someone who, you know, never mentioned to them, hey, I’m not in your network like this hospital is.

GROSS: So the bill that you’d get would be for the difference between what you pay when somebody is – when a doctor’s in network and what you pay when they’re not in network?

KLIFF: Yeah, often it’s just what that out-of-network doctor wants to charge. So a good example of this is a patient I wrote about in Texas named Scott (ph), who was attacked in downtown Austin, left on the street unconscious, some bystander called him an ambulance, and he woke up at a hospital. And one of the first things he does, because this is the United States, is he gets on his phone and tries to figure out which hospital he is at, and, you know, is that in his insurance network? And he finds out – good news – it is. And a surgeon comes by, tells him he’s going to need emergency jaw surgery because of the attack that happened.

So he says, OK. You know, he’s not really in a place to go anywhere. Gets the surgery. Goes home. A few weeks later, he gets an $8,000 bill from that oral surgeon, who the insurance companies paid a smaller amount. The oral surgeon didn’t have a contract with the insurance and said, you know, I think my services are worth a lot more, so pursued the balance of the bill from Scott.

GROSS: I have to say, I mean, that does seem unfair to the patient because they haven’t been informed. They can’t make a choice about it if they don’t know. And, like, $8,000 is a lot of money.

KLIFF: Yeah. And I think, you know, even more, let’s say he did say he was out of network. It kind of puts the patient in an unfair situation, too. You know, one of the things we talk about a lot in health policy is, what if we had more transparency? What if we let patients know the prices? What if we let patients know who is in and out of network? And that – it would be a good step.

But, you know, I think with someone like Scott, sitting in a hospital with a broken jaw, there’s not much you can do with that information. He doesn’t have, you know, the ability to go home, like, research, like, make an appointment with a new surgeon. So, you know, it’d be great if he knew that the doctor was out of network. It’d be even better if he had some kind of protections against those type of bills.

GROSS: What kind of protection could there be?

KLIFF: So we’re actually seeing a lot of action on this in Congress. There’s some pretty strong bipartisan support for tackling this specific issue and essentially holding the patient harmless. When there is a situation like Scott’s, for example, where there’s this $8,000 bill, that’s really a dispute between a health insurance company and a doctor, where the doctor says, I want more money, the insurer says, I want to pay you less money. And what Congress wants to do – what a few states have already done with their laws – is said, you can’t go to the patient for that money. You, the hospital, and you, the health insurance company, you have to get down to a table and work things out together.

And some state laws will set certain amounts that are allowed to be charged, other ones will force the insurance company and the hospital into an arbitration process. But the general concept is to take the patient out of this billing situation because, like you said, Terry, they really aren’t in a position to negotiate. They aren’t in a position to shop. They shouldn’t be the ones who are left holding the bag at the end of the day.

GROSS: My guest is Sarah Kliff. She covers health policy for Vox. After a break, we’ll talk more about why ER bills can have some unpleasant surprises, and she’ll give us an update on Obamacare. And Maureen Corrigan will review two books about forgotten stories from Hollywood. I’m Terry Gross, and this is FRESH AIR.

(SOUNDBITE OF JESSICA WILLIAMS TRIO’S “KRISTEN”)

GROSS: This is FRESH AIR. I’m Terry Gross. Let’s get back to my interview with journalist Sarah Kliff, who covers health policy and how it affects people for Vox. For the past year and a half, she’s been writing about why emergency room visits can be so expensive and the pricing so secretive and mysterious, as well as inconsistent from one hospital to the next. She collected over 1,000 bills and tracked down stories behind the billing. She interviewed many of the patients and the people behind the billing to decipher why ER bills can have some surprise costs.

Here’s another surprise that often awaits people who go to emergency rooms – some insurance plans only cover true emergencies, and whether it is a true emergency is sometimes determined after the diagnosis is made. So how are you supposed to know before the diagnosis whether you’re going to be categorized as a true emergency or not? Like, if you go to the hospital, you don’t know if you have a broken bone or not.

KLIFF: Right.

GROSS: Somebody needs to X-ray it and tell you.

KLIFF: Right. The whole point you go to the emergency room is to help them figure out what the emergency is and what treatment you need. This is a policy that the insurance company Anthem has been pioneering for a few years. It’s been in Kentucky. It’s been in Georgia – a few other states. And, you know, I wrote about one patient out in Kentucky named Brittany, who – she was having really severe abdominal pain. She called her mom who is a nurse, and the nurse said, that might be appendicitis. You’ve got to get to the emergency room. Turns out it wasn’t appendicitis. It was an ovarian cyst. She got it treated elsewhere later down the line.

And Anthem, you know, sent her a letter saying, we’re not going to cover that visit because it was not a true emergency. She appealed it. Her appeal was denied. This is another one where, once I started asking them about it, the bill suddenly disappeared. But – and it seems like as Anthem has gotten more attention for this policy – they haven’t announced it publicly, but some pretty compelling data The New York Times got their hands on suggest they’ve backed off this policy.

But it’s just, you know – there are so many traps you can fall into going into an emergency room. It just feels like you’re walking into this minefield, and this is kind of one of those mines that’s lurking in there.

GROSS: Hospital pricing and emergency room pricing seems to vary so much from hospital to hospital. Are there, like, national guidelines that help determine what a hospital or a hospital emergency room charges for services? I mean, who decides, and why is there such a variation?

KLIFF: So hospital executives get to decide, and I think that is why there is such variation. There aren’t really guidelines that they’re following. You know, one thing you could do as a hospital executive – you could look at what Medicare charges – those prices are public – and, you know, maybe use that as a benchmark. There are some databases. There’s one called FAIR Health, for example, where you could look and see, you know, some information on what local prices typically are. But in terms of, you know, what you want to charge, that’s kind of up to you as someone running a hospital.

One of the things that’s really, really unique about the United States, compared to our peer countries, is that we don’t regulate health care prices. Nearly every other country in the developed world – they see health care something as, you know, akin to a utility that everyone needs, like electricity or water. It’s so important that the government is going to step in and regulate the prices. That doesn’t happen in the United States. You know, if you’re a hospital, you just choose your prices. And, you know, that is, I think, why you see so much variation and why you see some really high prices in American health care.

GROSS: So what advice do you have for people who actually need an emergency room and don’t want to get hit with a shocking bill afterwards?

KLIFF: Yeah, this is, you know, one of those questions – it just makes me a little frustrated that – ’cause this is the most common question I get – right? – is, how do I – how do we – how do I prevent a surprise bill? And I find it kind of upsetting that, you know, it has to be on the patient because honestly, there really isn’t a great way to do this. I’ve talked to so many patients who tried so hard to avoid a big medical bill and weren’t able to.

You know, there’s certain things, yes, you can do. You can look up the network status of your hospital. You can try and badger each doctor you see about whether they are in network. You can try to be a really proactive patient, but I think that’s just such a huge burden on people who are in, like, really emergent situations. And some people don’t have that opportunity, you know, like Justin Zanders, the guy we were talking about earlier who was taken to a hospital while he was unconscious. I cannot think of anything he could’ve done to avoid that bill. It just was not possible.

GROSS: So your advice is, good luck.

KLIFF: Short of that, I mean, good luck. You know, I’m actually in the middle of reporting a story right now about people who have successfully negotiated down their bills. And, you know, you can certainly – if you do end up with a surprise bill, you can call up the hospital, see if there’s a discount. Sometimes there will be. Sometimes there won’t. You can call again. Customer service representatives – different ones – often offer you different discounts, I’ve learned from interviewing patients. You can ask for a prompt pay discount if you pay right away.

You can – you know, one health attorney who negotiates these a lot on behalf of patients – he says one of his favorite tactics is to choose the amount you want to pay; send a check with that amount; and in the note, write, paid in full; and hope they don’t come after you after that. I have no idea if that works or not, but he says it works for his patients. But it’s a mixed bag. And at the end of the day, the hospital has all the power. You can ask for discounts. You can ask nicely. You can ask angrily. It’s up to the hospital if they want to grant you that or not.

GROSS: So what is the status of Obamacare now? You know, Republicans promised to repeal and replace. That didn’t work out. So have Republicans given up on repeal and replace?

KLIFF: For the time, it seems pretty clear that repeal and replace is dead on arrival, especially with Democrats taking control of the House this year. Those proposals aren’t being talked about as much. They’re not really going anywhere. The one big thing we did see Republicans succeed at is repealing Obamacare’s individual mandate, the requirement that all of us carry health insurance. That happened as part of the big tax package that passed at the end of 2017.

So we’ve seen, you know, President Trump, for example, essentially declare victory, declare that repealing the individual mandate is repealing Obamacare, so we’re good on that goal. But, you know, generally, Obamacare is still standing. There are millions of people getting their coverage through the Affordable Care Act still today.

GROSS: So now that there’s no individual mandate, conservative attorney generals are challenging Obamacare – the Affordable Care Act – and saying it’s no longer constitutional after Congress’s repeal of the individual mandate. Could you explain that?

KLIFF: Yeah, so this is a challenge that’s come up through the courts in the past few months. Obamacare is constantly being challenged in court. It’s been through multiple Supreme Court suits. This one – you know, it’s a multiple-part argument, so I’ll try my best to walk through it.

GROSS: OK.

KLIFF: So essentially, it starts with the fact that the individual mandate – they weren’t quite able to repeal it for boring technical reasons. But what they were able to do is change the fee for not having health insurance from $700 to $0. So it – in all practical terms, it feels like repealing it because there is no fee for not carrying health insurance. The individual mandate was upheld as a tax when the Supreme Court said, yes, this is constitutional. The government has a right to tax people. Now that there is no fee associated with not carrying health insurance, the conservative attorneys general who are bringing this case argue that it’s not a tax anymore, and therefore, it is not constitutional. That whole defense that John Roberts wrote in 2012 is moot. So that’s the first part of it.

They go even further and say the individual mandate is so core to the Affordable Care Act, it is not severable. And if you, the courts, rule the individual mandate unconstitutional, then you need to rule all of Obamacare unconstitutional. And the first judge who heard this case – he is a, you know, judge in a district court in Texas. He agreed with them. He agreed that – first step – that the individual mandate is no longer constitutional. And second step, that means that the entirety of Obamacare has to fall. This is now being appealed up to the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals.

And I will say there are a lot of critics of this case. There are a lot of people who were parties to previous Supreme Court challenges to Obamacare who think this is a bad legal argument and that it will not succeed. But it is already, you know, gone through the district court level. It’s moving up to the appellate court level. It is something that is in the mix that could become a threat to the Affordable Care Act.

GROSS: Well, if it goes to the Supreme Court, it would be very interesting to see what Justice Roberts says since he voted for the ACA, saying that the individual mandate was a tax.

KLIFF: Yeah. You know, and I think where some legal scholars would see it shaking out is that the – someone like John Roberts, he might agree, OK, yeah, the individual mandate is unconstitutional, but would not make the leap to the second half of this, that the rest of the law has to fall.

I think one of the most compelling arguments against this case is that Congress knew what they were doing when they repealed the individual mandate. You know, they had the opportunity to repeal Obamacare. They didn’t. They’d specifically took aim at this one specific part. So it feels like it might be a bit of a reach to argue that what Congress really meant to do was repeal all these other parts of the Affordable Care Act. But, you know, the Supreme Court is changing. We have a new justice. You know, we have a lot in the mix. So it’s always an open question of how a decision like this could go.

GROSS: So correct me if I’m wrong here – the Department of Justice has sided with the conservative attorneys general who are challenging Obamacare, saying it’s no longer constitutional, and I think that the Justice Department is also asking the judge to strike down the ACA’s mandatory coverage of pre-existing conditions.

KLIFF: Yeah, that’s right. So it’s a kind of unusual situation. Usually, it’s the Justice Department that is going to defend a federal law in court. But, you know, given the Trump administration’s opposition to the Affordable Care Act, they have decided to side with the conservative attorneys general. They have a slightly different argument. They don’t think all of Obamacare should fall if the mandate falls, but they do think some big parts, like you mentioned, the protections for pre-existing conditions, should be ruled unconstitutional if the mandate falls.

So this has led to a bit of an unusual situation where you’ve had this coalition of Democratic attorneys general step in and take over the case, basically saying that the federal government is going – is not going to defend the Affordable Care Act. We are going to defend the Affordable Care Act. So you have this coalition of Democratic attorneys general, led by the attorney general of California, stepping in and, you know, offering a defense as this case works its way up through the court system.

GROSS: Let’s take a short break here, and then we’ll talk some more. If you’re just joining us, my guest is Sarah Kliff. She’s senior policy correspondent at Vox, where she focuses on health policy. And she hosts the Vox podcast “The Impact,” about how policy actually affects people. We’ll be right back. This is FRESH AIR.

(SOUNDBITE OF THE WEE TRIO’S “LOLA”)

GROSS: This is FRESH AIR. And if you’re just joining us, my guest is Sarah Kliff, senior policy correspondent at Vox, where she focuses on health policy.

Do you think health insurance is shaping up to be a big issue in the 2020 campaign?

KLIFF: I do, and I think it’s going to be a big issue both in the primary, where you’re already seeing candidates get pressed on, should we still have private health insurance, and giving pretty different answers to that question.

And then I think one of the things you’re also going to see is whoever is the Democratic nominee is probably going to run on Obamacare. They are going to point at the fact that President Trump tried to repeal the Affordable Care Act. That’s pretty different than, you know, the 2012 election, where Democrats were pretty scared to run on Obamacare. It still wasn’t popular. The benefits hadn’t rolled out. In this past midterm and now again in the 2020 election, it seems pretty clear that Democrats are pretty excited to point out that Republicans wanted to repeal Obamacare. So I think it really will come up.

GROSS: What are some of the biggest falsehoods you’ve heard from politicians about health insurance costs or health insurance policy?

KLIFF: You know, one of the ones that’s come up a lot is actually around the role of private health insurance. So I’ve – I don’t know if it counts as a falsehood, but I think it’s a bit of a misunderstanding of how health insurance often works is, you know, when I talk to single-payer supporters, most of them want to eliminate private insurance completely. They just don’t think there is a role for it in the health care system.

And one of the things I think that’s actually pretty interesting, when you look at any other country – you look at Canada, you look at the U.K., you look at France, which all have national health care systems – all of them have a private health insurance market, too. There are always some kind of gap in the system that the public insurance can’t cover, where the government step – where the private industry steps in and offers coverage. In Canada, for example, their public health plan doesn’t cover prescription drugs, so two-thirds of Canadians take out a private plan, often through their employer, like us, to cover prescription drugs, to cover their eyeglasses, to cover their dental. So I think that’s a confusion I see a lot in the “Medicare for All” debate coming up right now.

I think the other thing I see a lot of confusion around – and we’ve talked about this a little bit with emergency room billing – is the role of transparency in health care. I see a lot of, you know, if we just made the prices public, like, that is what we need to do to fix the system, and I think that really misses the fact that, even if the prices were public, health care is so different from everything else we shop for. It might be – I think it is the only thing we purchase when we are unconscious.

GROSS: (Laughter).

KLIFF: And when you’re unconscious, you’re not really going to be great at price shopping. So I see that as, you know, a halfway solution that I often hear talked about here in Washington that would be great but is not going to suddenly result in, you know, prices dropping because they’ve been exposed in a spotlight.

GROSS: Is there a country that you think has a good health care model that we could borrow?

KLIFF: Oh, yeah. I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately actually. So I’ve gotten very interested in the Australia health care system, which is a little far away. But I think they’re a really interesting model because they have a public system, everyone’s enrolled in it, but they also really aggressively try and get people to buy a private plan, too, and that private plan will get you sometimes faster access to doctors, maybe a private room at a hospital.

It’s really hard for me to see the U.S. creating a health care system, similar to Canada’s actually, where you can’t buy private insurance, where if you’re rich or you’re poor, everyone waits in the exact same queue, you can’t jump to the front of the line. Because I think wealthier Americans have gotten so used to having really good access to health care that they would be very upset with a system like that.

I think Australia is a kind of interesting hybrid between, you know, where we’re at in the U.S. right now and what Canada is like, where it says, yes, we’re going to create a public system for everybody, but we’re also going to have these private plans that compete against the public system. So I’ve become increasingly, you know, interested in how Australia’s system works. And they have – about 47 percent of Australians are buying a private plan to cover the same benefits that the public plan does.

GROSS: So it’s not supplemental. It’s instead of.

KLIFF: Right. So it’s very different from Canada. So in Canada, you can buy complementary insurance, you know, to cover the benefits the public plan doesn’t but the government expressly outlaws supplemental insurance. You know, like, what people buy here to cover the gaps in Medicare, that is not allowed. You cannot buy your way to the front of the line in Canada.

One of my favorite sayings about the Canadian health care system is from a doctor in a book I read about Canadian health care is they said, you know, we’re fine waiting in lines for health care in Canada as long as the rich people and the poor people have to wait in the exact same line. Their system is all about equality. And I just don’t know that we’re at a place as a country where we value the same sort of equality in our health care system.

GROSS: Is there any developed country around the world that has a system similar to ours with all these competing insurance companies and, you know, some government plans and, like, a thousand different bureaucracies that doctors have to deal with and that patients have to deal with?

KLIFF: Absolutely not. There’s nothing like it. I mean, our system is so unique. I’d say the closest but it’s not even close are a few countries that have national health care systems, but they do it through tightly regulated private health insurance plans. So if you look at, like, Netherlands or Israel, there isn’t a government-run plan. Instead, in both countries, you actually have four tightly regulated health insurance plans that compete against each other for the citizens’ business. I guess that’s the closest, but that is so different from what we have here right now. There’s really nothing like it in any developed country.

GROSS: Sarah Kliff, thank you so much for talking with us.

KLIFF: Well, thank you for having me.

GROSS: Sarah Kliff covers health policy for Vox, where you’ll find her series about emergency room bills. After we take a short break, Maureen Corrigan will review two books about forgotten stories from Hollywood. This is FRESH AIR.

(SOUNDBITE OF GEORGE FENTON AND PHILHARMONIC ORCHESTRA’S “MISS SHEPHERD’S WALTZ”)

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Opioid Litigation Brings Company Secrets Into The Public Eye

“What’s important to me is that the facts come to light and we get justice and accountability,” Massachusetts Attorney General Maura Healey said about litigation that has made internal Purdue Pharma documents public.

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America’s big drugmakers and pharmacy chains are scrambling to respond to hundreds of lawsuits tied to the deadly opioid epidemic. Billions of dollars are at stake if the companies are found liable for fueling the crisis.

Even before judgments are rendered, companies like Purdue Pharma, Johnson & Johnson and CVS are already suffering damage to their reputations as evidence in civil suits reveals more about their internal workings.

“The narrative is clearly shifting on this story,” said David Armstrong, a senior reporter with ProPublica, who has covered the drug industry for years. “People want some sort of reckoning, some sort of accounting.”

One reason for the shift is that cities and states filing these suits are moving more aggressively to pull back the curtain on the drug industry’s practices, urging courts to make internal memos, marketing strategies and reams of other documents public.

“Our next battle is to get the depositions and the documents that are being produced made available to the public, instead of everything being filed under confidentiality agreements,” said Joe Rice, one of the lead attorneys bringing lawsuits against drug companies on behalf of local governments in Ohio.

A growing number of documents have already been released, or been leaked to the press, and many of the revelations they contain have been troubling. In internal memos, Purdue executives acknowledged that their prescription opioids are far more addictive and dangerous than the company was telling doctors. At the same time company directives pushed sales representatives to get even more opioids into the hands of vulnerable people, including seniors and military veterans.

Memos also show that Purdue executives developed a secret plan, never implemented, called Project Tango in which they acknowledged the escalating risk of the opioid epidemic. The program was allegedly designed to help Purdue profit from the growing wave of opioid dependency, by selling the company’s addiction treatment services to people hooked on products like their own OxyContin.

This increased transparency represents a big shift in the way opioid lawsuits are being handled. “We’ve done something that hasn’t been done before,” said Massachusetts Attorney General Maura Healey, who appeared in February on NPR and WBUR’s program On Point.

Massachusetts is suing Purdue, like dozens of other states, and Healey fought successfully to make all the documents her office had uncovered public, without redactions. “What Purdue’s own documents show is the extent of deception and deceit. What’s important to me is that the facts come to light and we get justice and accountability,” Healey said.

Purdue Pharma declined to speak with NPR, but the drug industry has fought these disclosures at every turn. They describe the information in these documents as proprietary, asserting that it should be viewed by the courts as corporate property. For years governments pursuing these cases mostly went along with those arguments.

In past opioid settlements, companies paid fines but insisted on gag orders. “The way it usually works is the language in the settlement requires either that the records be destroyed very quickly after the settlement or that they physically actually return the records to the drug company,” said ProPublica’s Armstrong.

That happened in 2007 when the Justice Department ended a criminal case against Purdue Pharma. It happened again a few years ago when the state of Kentucky settled a civil case with the company and that state’s attorney general destroyed thousands of pages of documents. As a result, few people in the wider public knew how serious the allegations were.

As more information has been revealed, it’s sparking fury. At a February hearing on Capitol Hill, Sen. Maggie Hassan, D-N.H., blasted industry executives. “Companies like Janssen and Purdue Pharma fueled this epidemic, employing deceptive and truly unconscionable marketing tactics despite the known risk, so you could sell more drugs to maximize your profits,” she said.

Jennifer Taubert heads the Janssen Pharmaceuticals unit of Johnson & Johnson, which makes and sells opioids. The company faces escalating lawsuits over its products, but Taubert denied any wrongdoing at the hearing. “Everything that we have done with our products when we’ve promoted opioid products, which we stopped marketing a long time ago, was appropriate and responsible,” she told lawmakers.

Yet according to the drug companies’ internal documents, firms including Johnson & Johnson pushed unscientific theories about drug addiction. They allegedly did so as part of an effort to convince doctors to prescribe even more opioids after patients showed signs of dependency.

This kind of industry backlash has happened before, such as when tobacco companies faced lawsuits in the 1990s. As those trials unfolded, the public learned for the first time about widespread corporate wrongdoing.

The difference here is that drug companies and their researchers have been seen by many in the public as healers and innovators, part of a trusted health care system.

There could be more revelations. With another big opioid trial set to begin in May in Oklahoma state court, attorneys are still fighting over millions of pages of documents, most of which the public has still never seen.

One possibility is that companies could agree to what’s known as a global settlement of these opioid cases, paying billions of dollars in compensation in hopes of winning new secrecy agreements.

If that happens, says ProPublica’s Armstrong, documents that help tell the full story of this drug epidemic could be destroyed or locked away for years. “I worry that we’re going to lose all this valuable information about how we got to this point with this crisis, who knew what when,” he said.

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